ICBCadvice | GETTING STARTED
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GETTING STARTED

Getting Started

 

In this section you will find some very helpful tips on making sure your ICBC claim gets started on the right track. You will also find some general information about ICBC and how the corporation works. If you are sued, as a result of a car accident you caused, there is also helpful information provided.

Introduction to ICBC

The Insurance Corporation of British Columbia (“ICBC”) is a unique insurance organization for a number of reasons:

 

  1. ICBC is a Crown or publicly owned corporation;
  2. The administration of the Corporation’s insurance plan is governed by Regulations under the Insurance (Vehicle) Act of British Columbia, (i.e. Part 7, Part 6, Part 9 etc.);
  3. ICBC operates on a not-for-profit basis, though it does run surpluses in some years;
  4. ICBC holds a Provincial monopoly for primary auto insurance products, most notably basic Third Party Liability (Part 6), as well as Accident Benefits (Part 7) and basic Uninsured Motorist Protection (“UMP”) (Part 10);
  5. ICBC has a virtual monopoly as it has close to a 90% market share in B.C. on optional auto insurance products such as excess Third Party Liability, Own Damage Coverage (Part 9), and excess UMP;
  6. ICBC is responsible for the handling of unidentified and uninsured motorist claims in B.C. (Part 8);
  7. In addition to possessing its own comprehensive computer databases, ICBC has direct access to some of the Motor Vehicle Branch’s databases; and
  8. As a monopoly auto insurer with comprehensive databases, ICBC has access to a wide spectrum of information.

 

In many respects, however, ICBC is very much like other insurance companies. This website attempts to demystify ICBC

The First Steps to Take Immediately After a Car Accident

Often, when you are involved in a motor vehicle accident, the element of shock or injury may prevent you from making logical decisions. If possible, try to preserve the evidence as much as possible because you never know what will come in handy.

 

While at the accident scene, it is helpful if you can obtain the following information:

  1. Obtain the names, addresses, phone numbers and driver’s license numbers of all parties involved in the accident, regardless of who is at fault for the accident and how minor the accident is;
  2. Have a look at the insurance of each of the motor vehicles involved in the accident so as to get the names of the registered owner and the insurance details;
  3. Look at the other parties’ driver’s license to avoid being given false information;
  4. Write down the plate numbers, including Province, of all the vehicles involved in the accident by looking at the license plates and registration;
  5. If a motor vehicle involved in the accident is registered outside British Columbia make sure you get the name of the insurance company;
  6. Find out the names and contact information of any witnesses;
  7. Take some pictures of the vehicles and their resting positions; and
  8. Take some notes about how the accident happened and draw a sketch of the accident scene.

 

The Motor Vehicle Act requires all individuals involved in a motor vehicle accident to remain at the accident scene, to render assistance and to exchange vehicle registration and license information with all parties involved in the accident. The Motor Vehicle Act also requires those involved in the accident to report the accident to the local police force within 24 hours in urban areas and within 48 hours in rural areas. The need to report only applies if the damages exceed $1,000 ($600 if a motorcycle is involved). When in doubt, it is best to simply report the accident to the police as soon as possible. Indeed, it is good practice, unless the accident was extremely minor and all parties agree to exchange information and leave the scene, to call the police from the accident scene. If it is a relatively minor accident without injuries, the police likely will not attend the accident scene but if it is more serious, with injuries involved, the police will attend the accident scene.

 

Note that if you leave the scene of the accident without reporting to the police and/or exchanging information with the other parties, you may be charged under the Motor Vehicle Act or may be held in breach of your contract of insurance with ICBC. The later result could cost you thousands of dollars when ICBC comes after you for the money they pay out under a claim.

 

Of particular note, if you are in a single vehicle accident, especially at night, the last thing you should do is walk from the scene. ICBC will assume you have something to hide like impaired driving and may breach you of your contract of insurance. The better approach is to call the police and wait for their instructions.

Initial ICBC Reporting Requirements

Ideally, you should contact the ICBC dial-a-claim center within 24 hours of the motor vehicle accident to report the accident. The representative at ICBC will ask for general insurance information, vehicle information and driver/owner information. The representative will also ask for details of the accident and whether or not you or your passenger(s) suffered an injury in the accident.

 

Specifically, the representative will ask for the following information:

  1. Your vehicle license plate number and registration;
  2. The name and the driver’s license number of the person driving your vehicle;
  3. The name, the license plate and driver’s license numbers of the other vehicle(s)/ parties involved in the accident;
  4. When the accident happened;
  5. Where the accident happened;
  6. General details of the accident;
  7. Your views on liability and whether or not you will accept responsibility; and
  8. Details of the injuries to the parties involved in the accident.

Note that when your phone dial-a-claim, the representative from ICBC at the other end of the phone is filling out a CL-75. This is an ICBC internal form, which provides details about your vehicle, the owner of the vehicle, the other party involved in the accident, the description of the accident, etc. Remember, whatever you tell this ICBC dial-a-claim representative will be recorded on a form and ICBC may use what you said against you in your claim if it helps them. Therefore, be very careful of what you tell the claims representative.

 

The contacts for the ICBS’s Dial-a-Claim Centre are:

  • 604-520-8222 in the Lower Mainland
  • 1-800-910-4222 outside the Lower Mainland
  • 1-800-910-4222 from out of Province
  • 604-592-8800 for out of Province claims

 

In summary, to be safe, you need to report to ICBC within 24 hours of the accident, regardless of the accident type.

 

With the exception of Hit and Run claims and claims involving an injury, ICBC offers you the convenience of reporting a claim 24 hours a day online. An ICBC adjuster will process the claim usually within 24 hours and post an online claim report notice, which you must then retrieve. You can also make the claim on-line at www.icbc.com.

Initial Medical Care

If you have been injured in an accident, it is very important to see a doctor as soon as possible to document the injuries. This will not only help you in in your recovery but also help avoid the argument from ICBC that you were not injured in the accident because you never sought early medical treatment.

 

If you cannot get in to see your regular doctor within 24 hours of the accident, try a walk-in clinic or emergency ward. Waiting a few days to see a doctor after an accident only heightens ICBC’s concerns about your injury claim. After all, according to ICBC, if you didn’t seek immediate treatment how injured can you possibly be?

Time Limits on Advancing an ICBC Claim

Section 97 of the Insurance Vehicle Regulation under the Insurance (Vehicle) Act provides that where you claim for Part VII benefits (no fault benefits); you have certain time limits to make a claim with ICBC:

1. Where an accident occurs for which benefits are provided under this Part, the insured shall

  • Promptly give the corporation notice of the accident,
  • Not later than 30 days from the date of the accident, mail to the corporation by registered mail, or deliver to the nearest claims centre of the corporation, a written report on the accident with particulars of the circumstances in which the accident occurred and the consequences of the accident, and
  • Within 90 days from the date of the accident furnish the corporation with a proof of claim in a form authorized by the corporation.

2. The corporation is not liable to an insured who, to the prejudice of the corporation, fails to comply with this section.

If the accident involves a driver who you cannot identify, there are similar time limits involved. Please review the section on hit-and-run claims.

Please note that you have a two-year limitation period after the accident to commence a lawsuit against the at-fault driver for compensation for injuries. You have a two-year limitation period after the accident, or after the last payment under Part VII, to bring a lawsuit against ICBC to force payment of Part VII benefits.

In summary, when you are involved in an accident, whether it is in British Columbia or otherwise, the best thing to do is make a claim to ICBC as soon as possible.

Initial Meeting at ICBC

After making a dial-a-claim report, ICBC often will arrange a face-to-face meeting for you with an adjuster to review the vehicle damage, obtain a statement on the accident circumstances and address the injury claim.

 

If liability is straight forward against the other driver and there is no injury claim, there is no real risk of going to the ICBC face-to-face meeting. If you have an injury claim, however, you may wish to avoid the meeting. You can do that by having your vehicle damage inspected at an ICBC certified repair shop, providing a written statement without a meeting or sending a family member or friend into ICBC for the vehicle inspection.

 

If you plan to not hire a lawyer and deal with the claim yourself, the initial meeting is unavoidable. ICBC will insist that you come in for a meeting.

 

There is no question that when you first meet with the ICBC adjuster, he/she is not only trying to find out generally about the injury and damage claim but is also trying to establish evidence to minimize the amount of the ultimate payout to you. Hence, when you show up at the claim center, the ICBC adjuster is trying to get full access to information in order to ultimately reduce any amount ICBC has to pay to you at the end of the claim. After all, a central role of any adjuster is to minimize pay-outs. If you do not show up to the meeting, the adjuster does not get that same advantage.

 

The biggest negative about not showing up to the ICBC adjuster meeting, however, is that some adjusters personalize cases and may give you a more difficult time because you have not allowed them full access to information.

 

In terms of getting an estimate for vehicle damage, you can either attend to an ICBC claim center and see an estimator or you can go to a ICBC certified repair shop. There are a number of ICBC certified repair shops that will do estimates for ICBC, so you may never have to step foot inside the ICBC claim center. Note, however, that ICBC tries to force the face-to-face meeting if an injury claim is involved so there will be some push back from ICBC to get the face-to-face meeting.

 

Even if there is an issue over who is at fault for the accident, you have no legal requirement to go in to see an adjuster. Rather, you can simply provide your own written statement to the adjuster, which can be used by the adjuster to assess liability. Some adjusters may penalize you for not showing up to the meeting by taking a hard line against you on liability.

 

If you have an injury claim, you can provide your own short handwritten statement to the adjuster about the accident and injuries. You then need to fill out an Accident Benefit Claim Form (CL-22) if you want to pursue your entitlement to disability and medical benefits, which are called Part VII benefits.

 

The ICBC adjusters are trained to obtain detailed statements, which can later be used against you in an injury claim. The ICBC adjuster will cover off pre-accident health issues with you. If you do not disclose everything, you can be rest assured the ICBC lawyer or adjuster will later suggest that there are issues with your credibility because of the non-disclosure. Further, if you do not disclose fully all of your injuries at the time of the statement, you will later be accused of fabricating new injuries or ICBC will suggest they are not all related to the accident due to late onset of the injuries. In other words, the statement is a key piece of evidence that is used against you later in your injury claim and that is why ICBC in interested in having you sit down and sign a long statement at that initial meeting.

 

If you are prepared to allow this statement taking exercise to happen, be very careful. Be as accurate as possible when giving your statement and provide full details on the issues covered. Do not sign a statement if it contains any errors, as you will only be penalized later if you try to backpeddle from what is written in the statement.

 

When filling out the Accident Benefit Claim Form (CL-22), you are asked a number of questions including the type of injuries suffered. Make sure the form is complete because if you miss an injury, ICBC is going to point to this document later to say you may be fabricating a new injury or the injury came on too late after the accident to be related.

 

The other thing ICBC likes you to do is sign blank authorizations, which allow them access to anything they want, whether it be medical documents, wage loss documents or school records. It is strongly recommended that you do not sign blank authorizations, but simply tell the adjuster that if a specific document is needed, the adjuster can send an authorization form at that time and you will consider each request individually. In other words, if ICBC wants to get records from the hospital where you attended after the accident, they can get you to sign an authorization directed only to that hospital.

 

If you sign a blank authorization, you are almost guaranteed that ICBC will be ordering clinical records dating back many years before the accident. The adjuster will have a chance to check out a lot of personal information about you that is completely unrelated to the injury claim. That is why it is a bad idea to sign blank authorizations.

 

Overall, your only obligation is to provide a statutory statement to ICBC, which can be as little as providing your name, one sentence on the accident and a few words about injuries or even less for that matter. In other words, there is no obligation to provide any details in the statement. The rule of thumb is the less ICBC knows the better off you are. The only time it’s advantageous to disclose information to ICBC is if it helps you advance your claim at the time of settlement, helps you get a money advance on your claim or it helps get funding for rehabilitation or disability benefits through Part VII coverage.

 

In summary, if you wish to attend at the initial adjuster interview, keep in mind that the adjuster is probably trying to build ICBC’s defense case against you, while at the same time leaving the impression that this interview is for your benefit. The adjusters are trained to minimize claims, if possible, and so the initial meeting will likely have a focus towards that purpose.

The ICBC Adjuster - Wearing Two Hats

Like any big company with thousands of employees, you are going to come across a wide variety of personalities and approaches taken by the adjusters. Usually, your initial claim will be assigned randomly to an adjuster based on workflow at the claim center and the location where you live/work. You really do not have a lot of control over which adjuster is assigned to the file.

 

While some adjusters are genuinely concerned over injured claimants, you should never assume that the ICBC adjuster is working for you. Although the adjuster may say that you are the customer, the reality of the situation is that the adjuster’s performance is considered, in part, on how little the adjuster spends on a claim.

 

Two of the criteria under which an adjuster is marked on performance are “allocated expenses” and “severities”. Allocated expenses are the amount the adjuster spends per file on such things as ordering doctor reports, defense lawyer costs, etc… Severities is an adjusting term that refers to the amount paid out per file.

 

Obviously, the lower the allocated expenses and severities are, the better the adjuster is ranked amongst his/her colleagues. Hence, you may be mistaken if you think the adjuster is looking out for you. Unless the adjuster does not care much about performance yardsticks or his/ her personal success, chances are that the adjuster will be looking to minimize the amount paid out on your claim.

 

ICBC wears two hats. The first hat is where they suggest they are working for you to help you with your claim. The second hat is where the adjuster is trying to minimize the amount paid out to you regardless of what you truly deserve as a result of your injuries.

ICBC - The Determination of Liability

When two or more vehicles are involved in an accident and the issue of liability is contentious, ICBC will assign an adjuster to each motorist to determine the apportionment of liability between the motorists. Generally speaking, the adjusters will negotiate amongst themselves, in the absence of the motorists, and make an internal decision at ICBC on the apportionment of liability between the motorists.

 

If you are lucky, your adjusters will actually interview the independent witnesses in detail and make a reasoned decision. If you are unlucky, the adjusters will take a halfhearted approach to the determination of liability and make a decision quickly without much investigation.

 

Contrary to what ICBC may tell you, the ICBC internal determination of liability is not binding on you unless you accept ICBC’s position at face value. Unfortunately, if you do not like ICBC’s internal determination of liability you have the onus of overturning that decision. Without you overturning the decision, the internal decision of ICBC on liability will be the final say on the matter.

 

You have the option of asking ICBC for an internal review. This process involves a review of the issue of liability, by committee, at ICBC. Alternatively, your other option is to proceed to Small Claims/ Supreme Court on the issue of liability. A lawsuit on the issue of liability requires that you sue the other motorists involved in the accident not ICBC. If the Court decision is different than the one ICBC made internally then the Court decision stands.

 

Unfortunately, if you want to pursue the issue of liability in Court, ICBC will appoint a lawyer to represent the motorist you are suing. Therefore, you will be up against a lawyer unless you hire your own lawyer. Ultimately, the amount of expense and time needed to pursue a liability only lawsuit makes it not worth a lawsuit in most cases and you are stuck with ICBC’s decision.

 

In making a decision on whether or not to dispute liability, you should look at the percentage of fault apportioned against you based on ICBC’s decision. A finding of 25% or less fault against you will not affect your safe driving.

 

The ICBC determination on liability has some bearing on the outcome of your personal injury claim in that ICBC’s position on the claim will be affected by their views on liability. If they feel, for example, you are 50% at fault for the accident then they will only pay 50 percent of the true value of the claim.

 

If your personal injury matter goes to trial on damages and liability, the finding of liability by the Court will supersede the ICBC decision.

 

You should note that if ICBC initially found you 0% at fault for the accident and you have a personal injury claim, ICBC can still pursue a claim of liability against you in your personal injury action. In other words, when it is in ICBC’s best interest, they do not necessarily follow their own internal determination on liability. This fact highlights the inherent inequity in the system when ICBC does not have to follow their own rulings.

 

Another point is even if you win on liability in Court, trying to get ICBC to refund excess premiums paid is difficult. Getting them to correct your safe driving discount is equally as difficult.

ICBC’s Internal Review Process

In the event that you have a disagreement with ICBC, there are avenues within ICBC whereby you can try to get the decision overturned without suing ICBC. You can use the internal review process of ICBC for virtually all decisions of ICBC ranging from a liability determination, administration of Part VII benefits, vehicle repair issues, etc… The steps to follow are as follows:

 

  1. Speak to a Manager or Supervisor at the ICBC office you are dealing with: If you have a dispute or complaint about a decision, you should first contact the manager or supervisor at the location you are dealing with. You can discuss the issue with the manager or supervisor or else seek some direction on how to enter the Fair Practices Review.
  2. Fair Practices Review: If you have already dealt with a manager or supervisor, or have used an appeal or review process available in Step 1, and are still dissatisfied, you should launch a complaint through ICBC’s Fair Practices Review department.
  3. Fairness Commissioner: If you have followed the procedures in Step 1 and 2 and, after a review or investigation by the Fair Practices Review, you are still not satisfied, you may be eligible for a review by the Fairness Commissioner. This step involves requesting a review in writing. The Fairness Commissioner may conduct the review and make findings and recommendations with respect to unresolved issues.
  4. Lawsuit: If you have gone through the ICBC internal review process and still are not satisfied with the results, you can always sue ICBC. For smaller disputes, the Small Claims Court is the venue.

For more information on the ICBC internal dispute process, you can visit www.icbc.com.

Dealing with Multiple Insurance Companies

ICBC has a monopoly on basic insurance coverage meaning that they are usually involved in almost every motor vehicle accident case. However, on occasion you will also be involved with other insurance companies.

 

In recent years, British Columbians have been purchasing excess insurance, at a greater frequency, from non-ICBC insurance companies. Generally, you will never find out about this excess insurance carrier except when you have a serious claim, which is worth more than $200,000, and the at-fault motorist has excess coverage with a non-ICBC insurance company.

 

In that situation, the non-ICBC insurance company will want to be involved in making decisions on settlement and on the defense. The involvement of the non-ICBC insurance company generally does not affect your claim except ICBC has a tendency to be more careful in defending the claim when they have another insurance company looking over their shoulders. Also, you have the potential of one or more of the insurance companies playing hardball against you.

 

If you are the driver responsible for the accident and you have excess insurance with a non-ICBC insurance company then you will have to involve the non-ICBC insurance company with the vehicle repair along with any claim that is being advanced against you by the other motorists and his/her passengers.

 

Non-ICBC insurance companies can also become involved in accident claims where a motor vehicle is driven into the Province from either the United States or from another Province. The biggest problem you will face is that the non-ICBC insurance companies from outside British Columbia are not accustomed to the fact that the awards of damages in British Columbia tend to be higher than anywhere else in Canada and the USA. Also, in most instances, the ICBC statutory coverage for such things as Part VII benefits tend to be more generous than in other jurisdictions. Therefore, you have to get around the conservative mindset of these non-ICBC insurance companies and also, at times, educate them.

 

If the at-fault vehicle is insured by a non-ICBC insurance company it can cause problems with respect to compensation. This is because you will have to seek compensation from ICBC for Part VII benefits and compensation from the other insurance company for your other claims. Invariably, the insurance companies try to point fingers at each other in an effort to make each other pay.

 

The one big advantage of having a non-ICBC insurance company is that they are generally less willing to go to trial. ICBC has developed the reputation of being very litigious during certain cycles.

 

In summary, whenever another insurance company is involved in the claim, it usually makes the claim more complicated largely because of the interplay between ICBC and the other insurance company.

Keeping a Diary

While some lawyers may suggest you keep a pain diary on a day-today basis to record the problems you are having after an accident, the decision to have such a diary is really a personal decision. The difficulty with having such a diary is it focuses you on your problems, which is not a good thing psychologically. The advantage of having a diary is that you can refresh your recollection of the events after an accident when you are asked about them years later.

 

In terms of the diary, what you should do, as a minimum, is keep at least a calendar to show when you attended various appointments. The calendar should also note significant events that occurred after the accident such as when your back problems stopped bothering you, when you returned to work, etc…

 

Note that if the diary is not kept for litigation purposes or on the request of your lawyer, ICBC has a right to obtain a copy of the diary. Once ICBC gets the diary there can be plenty of evidence in it to be used against you in the injury claim. Therefore, only write a diary if your primary reason for doing so is to be used in the litigation process to advance your claim. If that is the purpose of the diary then “litigation privilege” falls over it and ICBC cannot compel production of the diary.

When I Am Sued As A Result of an ICBC Accident

As part of your insurance coverage with ICBC, you get what is called third-party liability coverage. The minimum limits you receive through ICBC are $200,000 coverage for damages you cause to others in an accident. You may use a non-ICBC insurance company to increase the basic limits or you can use ICBC.

 

As the size of claims arising out of accidents can potentially reach into the millions of dollars, the more third-party liability coverage, the better off you are. The reason for this coverage is that if you are sued for damages by another party and you are responsible for the accident, in whole or in part, ICBC will only pay a settlement or judgment against you to the maximum of your third-party liability insurance limits. You are personally responsible to pay any excess.

 

When you receive a lawsuit (Notice of Civil Claim) against you for an ICBC accident, do not panic. The best thing to do is contact your adjuster and notify him/her of the lawsuit. Assuming you have insurance without any breach, ICBC will take care of everything from that point on.

 

The only thing you have to do is be involved in such steps as getting interviewed by the defence lawyer, attending an Examination for Discovery to answer questions for the Plaintiff lawyer and/or attending a trial. Remember, full cooperation with the ICBC adjuster and your defence lawyer is essential as otherwise; ICBC will try to breach you of the contract of insurance. A breach would mean you have to pay the entire claim out of your own pocket.

 

In a situation where you are told by the defense lawyer the claims from the motor vehicle accident may exceed your policy limits, it is highly recommended that you consult a lawyer about the prospect of personal exposure to a judgment in excess of the policy limits. At the very least, your lawyer should be encouraging ICBC to try to settle the claim within the policy limits, so that you are not personally exposed for any excess judgment. A good lawyer will set up what is called a bad faith claim against ICBC. A bad faith claim is where ICBC does not keep your best interests in mind when they are trying to defend a claim and personally expose you to the excess judgment.

 

If ICBC is denying you coverage for various reasons such as drinking and driving, a principal operator breach, failure to cooperate, a false statement, etc… do not simply ignore ICBC’s denial of coverage, especially if you are responsible for the accident and you caused injuries to someone. The reason being, ICBC may defend the claims being advanced against you and may pay out the judgment or settlement but they will then look to you for reimbursement. The best thing to do is hire a lawyer and dispute ICBC’s denial of coverage unless there is no hope of getting insurance coverage.

 

Remember, if ICBC denies coverage, they administer the claims on the assumption there is no coverage and go after you for the amount they paid out under the claims. You have a positive obligation to establish coverage under the ICBC policy and you only have a one-year limitation period to sue ICBC over their decision to deny after the denial is initially made. In a breach situation, any pay-out by ICBC automatically becomes a debt against you which you need to pay back to ICBC unless you no longer wish to drive a vehicle or insure a vehicle in B.C.

 

In summary, so long as you have ICBC insurance coverage, in most situations ICBC will take care of defending any lawsuit against you and paying out any judgment up to the maximum of the policy limit. Your involvement in the case is probably going to be quite minimal.

Limitation Periods

A limitation period is a deadline before which you must start a lawsuit/ notify ICBC. If you do not meet the limitation period, you may lose your right to receive compensation. Therefore, it is very important to keep these limitation periods in mind when pursuing your ICBC claim.

 

Some of the important limitation periods are:

  1. For injury claims, you have two years from the date of the injury to start a lawsuit against the party responsible for your injuries (the “tortfeasor”);
  2. For Family Compensation Act proceedings (i.e. death claims) you have two years from the date of the death of the family member to start a lawsuit against the party responsible for the death;
  3. Where you are making a claim for a hit-and-run accident, you must give ICBC notice no later than six months after the accident but also when reasonably possible (i.e. don’t delay giving ICBC notice);
  4. Where a government municipality is involved in the claim, you need to give notice to the municipality within 2 months of the accident;
  5. If you want to bring an action against ICBC under your insurance policy (e.g. breach of the contract of insurance cases), you must start the lawsuit within one year of the denial;
  6. For Part VII/ No-Fault accident benefits, you have 30 days to notify ICBC of the accident and 90 days to file a proof of claim (CL-22 Accident Benefit Claim form); and
  7. For Part VII/ No-Fault accident benefits, you have two years to commence a lawsuit after the accident or the last payment under Part VII by ICBC, whichever is later.

 

If the person that is making the claim is under the age of majority (i.e. under 19) or is legally disabled than the limitation period does not apply to them unless ICBC sends a Notice to Proceed which will then initiate the running of the limitation period. This is a formal document ICBC will have to send by registered mail to you.

 

Note that ICBC has no obligation to notify you of the limitation period. They are very happy if you miss a limitation period and will take advantage of your error. Also, these limitation dates are not flexible. There are rare instances where you will be able to get around a missed limitation period.

Wes Mussio
Mussio Goodman
2050-1188 West Georgia St
Vancouver, B.C. V6E 4A2
Ph: 604-336-8000
Cell: 604-603-8835
E-mail: mussio@mussiogoodman.com